Microsoft reduces Softricity Licensing pricing by almost 85%

Microsoft’s acquisition of Softricity is now complete and there are some major changes to the licensing for SoftGrid. In a LiveMeeting Monday, Microsoft identified some key changes--some that are already in place and others that are coming.

Microsoft’s acquisition of Softricity is now complete and there are some major changes to the licensing for SoftGrid. In a LiveMeeting Monday, Microsoft identified some key changes--some that are already in place and others that are coming.

New Pricing

The biggest change comes with the new pricing that Microsoft announced this past Friday. All SoftGrid products have been consolidated into the following two licenses. These prices reflect an almost 85% reduction in client licensing costs alone.

Product Description

MSRP (US$)

SoftGrid Desktop License

$36

SoftGrid CAL for Terminal Services

$20

  • There are only two licenses available--the SoftGrid Desktop License and the SoftGrid CAL for Terminal Services. The Universal Desktop license is no longer available.
  • The SoftGrid platform, Sequencer, ZeroTouch and Microsoft SMS Extensions are all included in both licenses.
  • Under the new EULA, SoftGrid CALs for Terminal Services are no longer licensed on a concurrent user basis. They are now licensed the same way as Microsoft Terminal Server CALs--either per-user or per-device.
  • Minimum order quantities have been reduced to 5 licenses.

Softricity Software Assurance (SA) Agreements

Many changes have been made to the Softricity Software Assurance program. For the most part, there is no more SA being sold Softricity Licensing, with the exception of existing customers re-ordering product. Details are below:

New Customers

  • Software Assurance is suspended. SA will no longer be offered on new sales of SoftGrid licensing.
  • Hotfixes, patches and minor updates will still be provided for now, but no major revisions to product.
  • Customers will be able to purchase support incident packs to open support cases will Softricity. The Support Pack SKUs are not yet available, but should be by the time the product ships at the end of September.

Existing Customers

  • Existing agreements due to expire will not be renewed or extended. Microsoft is in the process of integrating the Softricity SKUs in with their Volume Licensing program and Microsoft’s “SA” will be available in the first half of 2007.
  • Existing customers will get upgrades to product provided their support agreement is still valid at the time the update is released (i.e. Vista-compatible version).

Existing Customers Re-Ordering Licenses

  • Only existing customers can purchase SA for re-orders on an existing agreement until either July 1, 2007 or the date their agreement expires, whichever comes first.

Release Schedules/Timelines

The Softricity name is staying for now. Microsoft feels that the Softricity brand has a lot of recognition in industry and is planning to capitalize on it. On the slides in the presentation, the logo now reads “A wholly owned subsidiary of Microsoft Corp”.

  • August 1, 2006 – new pricing/EULA is in effect. Existing customers’ re-orders can be fulfilled, and new orders can be placed, however new code will not ship until the end of September.
  • August 4, 2006 – Interim code released to support POCs (version 4.0.0.585; not supported for Production environments).
  • September 29, 2006 – Target date for revised code and fulfillment (production release). This release will not include ZeroTouch, most likely as a result of crucial open-source code being removed from the product.
  • Fall 2006 – ZeroTouch functionality will be released. The current version of ZeroTouch (1.11.99) will not be supported in the 9/29/2006 release. Customers wishing to deploy ZeroTouch will need to wait until it is released in the Fall.

Also in the Fall of 2006, Microsoft is expected to announce projected Volume Licensing offerings and upgrade paths.

  • First Half of 2007 – Microsoft Software Assurance will be available through the Volume Licensing programs. Microsoft is also expected to make the SoftGrid Platform available to all Microsoft channels for resale.
  • July 1, 2007 – All existing Softricity SA agreements will expire. SA will only be available via the Microsoft Volume Licensing programs.

What this means to the Industry

First, since SA is now defunct, there is no definitive answer from Softricity on how new customers will get updates to the software as there is no maintenance agreements available. The same also applies for customers whose maintenance expires before the expected release of Volume Licensing SA information.

Next, the product roadmap is unclear. Prior to the acquisition, Softricity's #1 goal was to have context communication working between virtual environments. Softricity does such a great job of isolating applications that it's almost a detriment. Now, Microsoft's focus is clearly on a 64-bit version and a Vista-compatible client. Beyond that, there is little information on where the product is going.

Microsoft obviously has serious competition with Altiris, and this acquisition is clearly meant to close the gap. Altiris' SVS is a direct competitor of Softricity, but now that the pricing is so low, it may give Microsoft an advantage.

In terms of Citrix Streaming Server (aka Tarpon), Softricity is now the first product that directly competes with Citrix. Presentation Server was always an "add on" to Terminal Server. However, customers will now have a decision to make between software virtualization platforms. It will be either Citrix OR Microsoft, but not both. I am curious to see how this will affect (if at all) the relationship between Microsoft and Citrix.

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...I dont think the Softricity channel is too happy about the new pricing.  Im curious if anyone thinks that Citrix will react by also dropping prices on the Access Suite.  This would also mean that their lower end product  - Access Essentials - might see a change.   Exciting times indeed!
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Speaking first-hand, I can tell you the channel has mixed feelings.  On one hand, with the reduced cost and the instant-validation of the technology with Microsoft's acquisition, it couldn't be easier for companies to adopt the technology.  On the other hand, any large shop that has a M$ Enterprise Agreement will obtain the software through there, which means sales of product will bit significantly less.

However, from a services perspective, there is going to be a huge need for technologists who know how to architect SoftGrid environments and sequence applications.  These are exciting times, indeed!

As for Citrix lowering the Access Suite costs, I don't think the Softricity pricing/acquisition will have any impact.  However, you might see Tarpon just lumped into the suite, or just made available for free to licensed users of Presentation Server.  It will be interesting to see what happens.
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I agree. This is a huge win for the consumer. Now small-medium sized businesses will be able to afford SoftGrid application streaming/virtualization where before they may have never been able to afford it. I can see places that normally were a perfect fit for Access Essentials now comparing it against Terminal Services with SoftGrid.
Citrix would be good to get Tarpon out there but it doesn't look like businesses are going to be that willing to pay extra for it. Even on PS4 I have not been wow'd by the AIE technology. It sometimes works but not very efficiently when it does (is it just me?).
How about Citrix works on its CAG/NetScaler to improve application streaming? How about figuring out how to get locally installed apps to integrate with "streamed" apps using their content redirection technologies? Citrix is definitely going to need to become an innovator in this arena rather than a follower.
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This is reaally kewl.. We use windows, powerfuse and citrix, which means our budgut is reached. Citrix is only used for the CAG and AppLB, so for a go on softgrid ment a no on Citrix. But now we dont have to phase citrix out before we can use softgrid.
 
I believe Citrix is dead, tarpon will come too late too little, big companies will choose 1 vendor over 2 and Citrix has no product after Longhorn. Its too easy to say they have had their chances (vmware/softricity), but if they dont offer anything new or extra in the SBC, they will become a niche product. Mayby if they would buy RES to offer a nice shield over the desktop for terminal servers? or their own desktop if longhorn will be gui'less (i dont even know thats still the case).
 
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If I were an enterprise, I wouldn't be worried about the update gap (or should I call it a window?).  If a new release is available and Microsoft left a support temporary hole that makes the release unavailable to newer customers they will make a move to fill that hole.
 
Basically, it sounds as though Microsoft/Softricity is going to focus on the Vista client first - so that would be a new purchase for anyone when it becomes available anyway.  Then you would expect them to focus on either the x64 and/or Longhorn server and/or the previously planned bubble/bubble work.
 
In my estimation, most of the kernel changes made in x64 and the Vista/Longhorn Betas should not be too hard for the development team to handle, with one exception - security.  SoftGrid violates a lot of borders that Microsoft has been setting up, and that will take some time to work out, especially since now the developers are subject to the Microsoft Security Audit process.  So basically, there might not be a release that happens inside the window anyway.
 
Enterprises should validate their needs against what is now available (or will be when re-badged soon) and know that bugs will be fixed as they are in other Microsoft products (spelled hot-fix).
 
The new pricing is a windfall for the enterprise.  Yes, you lose concurrent licensing on TS, but with the lower prices only very few would end up paying more.  VARs will still make a lot of money on Softricity - but it will be more in services than product.  I don't find that a bad thing for them either.
 
Tim Mangan
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Perhaps I'm missing something here, but I read that they are moving from a concurrency model to a per-user model.  In other words, folks will be buying about four times as many licenses to serve the same number of clients.  I wouldn't bat an eye if I were the channel for this product... the money will keep rolling in just as before.
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This will still be a huge savings to Softricity customers.  It's an 85% savings over the old licensing scheme.  That means the break even point would be if you had a deployment where only 15% of your installed client base accessed the SoftGrid environment.  Every organization that I have ever worked with SoftGrid on always licensed by the number of seats anyway, because their entire client base was using the environment.  Concurrent user model only worked out for Terminal Server deployments (either with the Universal Desktop client or the TS client); otherwise everyone licenses the product on a named user basis.  There is no difference between "named user" and "per-user".

And just to play devil's advocate, even if clients need to purchase "four times as many licenses", as you state, that's still 40% less than they would have spent on the old licensing model.  I don't care how you spin it, it's still a deal.
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i don't understand why everyone claims citrix to be dead the moment someone brings out a product or feature.
They've got heaps of talented developers and wads of cash. a company like Citrix doesn't just crumple and disappear - if sales decline in a product line then a company like that develops another product or buys a company that has another product which they can sell. Yes, presentation server might die (although i personally doubt that..), but doesn't mean Citrix the company is suddenly wiped off the face of the earth.
 
Personally i have had a _lot_ of success with implementing Citrix products; and by success i don't mean making money but deploying a top notch infrastructure.
So far i have not been given any tangible reason to think that this should change. Also if there's in future ever a question of buying a Microsoft product or a directly competing Citrix product, then based on this past positive experience with Citrix i'll recommend the Citrix product.
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Totally agree with you!
 
I also would like to add something around Streaming Server (aka Tarpon). Everyone that thinks this is just crap will get a surprise. There is number or reasons why Citrix Streaming Server is going to be a great alternative to SoftGrid: 1) It’s easy to get started with! 2) It’s very integrated to excising Citrix products, 3) Citrix got a lot of excising customers.
 
I think the most important is the integration - imagine that you as an administrator go to Access Suite console -> Publish an application -> Your choice is to make it available to your Presentation Server Farm or Streaming Server Farm. Everything will be seamless for the user: Browse to Web Interface or Access Centre (with AAC) -> Login -> Based on rules applications will be presented or streamed! How log will it take Microsoft/Softricity to make this kind of integration with excising Microsoft products? 1 year, 2 years, 3 years? They keep buying stuff and they will integrate it - also with Presentation Server and Streaming Server. Citrix has the advantage of being able to change VERY quickly.
 
From a business perspective both products solve the same problem: Reducing the cost of making applications accessible to users. Even if SoftGrid got a better underlying technology (SystemGuard), I think a lot of excising Citrix customers would like integration over SystemGuard. I know SoftGrid well and SystemGuard makes you run in to a lot of trouble.
 
It's a pity that Citrix didn't go for the Desktop earlier. They got lazy milking their "one product strategy" and possessed by "Access Strategy". Now they seems to get back in the game! Ahh, another thing. I don't Altiris with their SVS will be gone either. SVS solve the same problem from a business perspective and got a kick ass community, just as Citrix does - right?
 
//Sorry, I have to stay anon.
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ORIGINAL: Guest

I think the most important is the integration - imagine that you as an administrator go to Access Suite console -> Publish an application -> Your choice is to make it available to your Presentation Server Farm or Streaming Server Farm. Everything will be seamless for the user: Browse to Web Interface or Access Centre (with AAC) -> Login -> Based on rules applications will be presented or streamed! How log will it take Microsoft/Softricity to make this kind of integration with excising Microsoft products? 1 year, 2 years, 3 years?



Actually, this is available today (and has been for a while) with Softricity's ZeroTouch product (now free with SoftGrid).  It does everything you describe, AND it integrates with both Citrix and Terminal Server farms.  In regards to SystemGuard, I agree that it does such a great job of isolation that it can get in the way occasionally, but never to the point that it can't be dealt with.
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I was told by Softricity sales on 8/8/06 that the support would be handled just like any other Microsoft product - there is no out-of-box support, but you can purchase it on a per-incident basis ($250 i think). This is good and bad news...First, for those of us who are Microsoft partners, we should be able to use our support incidents that come with the partnership and of course business critical down support at no charge. The bad news is that every time I have trouble packaging a new app with the sequencer, I can't simply pickup the phone and call Softricity support to get help. Has anybody heard anything different about this?
 
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I asked some of the same questions when on the LiveMeeting conference call.  I was told that channel support for SCCP partners will remain the same.  A Softricity partner can pick up the phone and submit an incident with their support center just as before.  Customers will be able to puchase support incident packs in order to open support cases.  However, those support packs are not yet available. Rumor has it that they will be available sometime in October when the production product is released.
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From a user perspective ZeroTouch does the same but not from a administrative perspective. Becides, what I was saying (or trying to say) is that Softricity got integration within their own products but there is no integration with excisting Microsoft products, yet (yes they got a plugin for SMS, but it doesn't do much...). So what I'm saying is that I think it will take a while until we see SoftGrid and SMS as one single product, integrated with MOM. Meanwhile I think both Citrix and Altiris will be good alternatives and even be able to envolve faster than Microsoft/Softricity.
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There is always two sides of a rumour :)
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i don't understand why everyone claims citrix to be dead the moment someone brings out a product or feature.
They've got heaps of talented developers and wads of cash. a company like Citrix doesn't just crumple and disappear - if sales decline in a product line then a company like that develops another product or buys a company that has another product which they can sell. Yes, presentation server might die (although i personally doubt that..), but doesn't mean Citrix the company is suddenly wiped off the face of the earth.
 
I dont agree... Presentation server is way old (how old is winframe, 10years now?) and in all this time they have improved the product (greatly), but added only more features, the main product has stayed the same. Which Citrix product would you buy without presentation server? I miss the main innovations; someone on this forum said Citrix is following the SBC space, while they should be defining it.
 
Personally i have had a _lot_ of success with implementing Citrix products; and by success i don't mean making money but deploying a top notch infrastructure.
So far i have not been given any tangible reason to think that this should change. Also if there's in future ever a question of buying a Microsoft product or a directly competing Citrix product, then based on this past positive experience with Citrix i'll recommend the Citrix product.

 
I agree that Citrix is a must have for now, but you should read the former articles brian wrote here about the new windows server vs Citrix. And thats not too far away.. what do they have now?
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Hi there, it's me the previous poster -
 
Sorry but i have to counter-disagree once more, Citrix now has netscaler and Citrix now has the access gateway and Citrix will soon have WANScaler which i am confident will present serious competition to the Packeteers of this world, and just like with PS i would very happily recommend those as i have in the past to clients - once again; with past success. OK, so your average SBC shop won't sell those, however i don't think Citrix care who recommends or buys products from them as long as they make money - and hell, why should they?

In terms of longhorn - Ok, so we have a feature list for what longhorn will most likely (see sidebar below) offer, most likely in about 12-18 months time. And to MS's credit, good on them for being so open, however we haven't seen a featurelist of what PS will offer in 12-18 months time.
 
That's because Citrix play their cards close to their chest - so how can you assume that a company with thousands of employees, business strategists, market analysts, shareholders, etc is completely oblivious to what you and i both clearly know about longhorn? it just doesn't make an ounce of sense to me personally.
 
Sidebar: unless there is some signed committment of features by MS i'll say most likely - ie. exchange 12's magically shrinking promised features, Portal Server 2003 broken promises, Vista's VapourFS i mean WinFS, Vista delays, blablabla
 
Lastly, let's assume MS keep their promises this time, and magically everyone uninstalls PS and stops their SA agreements. Then Citrix will have hundreds or thousands of developers ready to pounce on one of their other products ie wanscaler, netscaler, access gateway to dominate these markets even more, with plenty of developers left to make redundant or make a whole new kind of software product.
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You are mistaken if you think, at least at this point wth the features, that Longhorn will offer you something above and beyond what Citrix does.  The features in Longhorn will not truly enable most companies to move away from Presentation Server. 
 
 
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i think you might have misinterpreted by post - i know that Longhorn doesn't bring anything above and beyond citrix (and in fact i suspect it might end up bringing less TS-related features than one may expect at the moment).
 
I also don't think Longhorn will make a significant chunk of people move away from PS. Certainly not in the slice of the market where Citrix are primarily chasing customers.
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to the situation than you were...Let me just say this if you have a product that you think is the cat's meow, why do you try to buy a company 6-8 months before your release date....To me that tells me your product is not quite working out, or you want to snatch it up before a bigger shark in the sea has the ability to hurt you...
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You must remeber that customers are paying huge sums of money in subscription adavantage for what si essentially a product that has been made obsolete by Longhorn. It will get harder and harder to justify the cost of subscription, Citrix know this and they have annouced they are taking their subscriptions direct (surprise surprise). If a third of my billion dollar revenue cam efrom PS 4.0 subscriptions I would want to be in charge of them also!
 
A lot of customer will have to question the costs of paying for soemthing they get for free. Citrix' other products don't nearly make up the revenue for them. The best they can do is purchase other technologies quick and then package and market them with the Citrix brand and get them out to the channel fast. Are they purchasing companies quick enough though?
 
ORIGINAL: Guest

i think you might have misinterpreted by post - i know that Longhorn doesn't bring anything above and beyond citrix (and in fact i suspect it might end up bringing less TS-related features than one may expect at the moment).

I also don't think Longhorn will make a significant chunk of people move away from PS. Certainly not in the slice of the market where Citrix are primarily chasing customers.

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Please fill us in on the features that will make PS obselete when Longhorn comes out?  have you even played with Longhorn and the new features?  I'm guessing you have not because you would know that the features, while nice, are not anywhere near what PS offers. 
 
Many customers will question as they always do when a new version of Windows comes out, but they will not move because the advantages of PS still outweigh what MS offers.  Sorry guest but you are wrong.
 
 
 
ORIGINAL: Guest

You must remeber that customers are paying huge sums of money in subscription adavantage for what si essentially a product that has been made obsolete by Longhorn. It will get harder and harder to justify the cost of subscription, Citrix know this and they have annouced they are taking their subscriptions direct (surprise surprise). If a third of my billion dollar revenue cam efrom PS 4.0 subscriptions I would want to be in charge of them also!

A lot of customer will have to question the costs of paying for soemthing they get for free. Citrix' other products don't nearly make up the revenue for them. The best they can do is purchase other technologies quick and then package and market them with the Citrix brand and get them out to the channel fast. Are they purchasing companies quick enough though?

ORIGINAL: Guest

i think you might have misinterpreted by post - i know that Longhorn doesn't bring anything above and beyond citrix (and in fact i suspect it might end up bringing less TS-related features than one may expect at the moment).

I also don't think Longhorn will make a significant chunk of people move away from PS. Certainly not in the slice of the market where Citrix are primarily chasing customers.


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I totally agree with Jeff...  If you actually saw their "remote programs" functionality, you would immediately see it is a half-baked solution.  It might be fine for customers who have not yet invested in Citrix and only need basic funtionality for a small number of servers, but NO ONE  in an enterprise environment will drop Citrix for this.

Everyone talks about how great the Longhorn "features" are, and how they are going to change the SBC space, but everyone forgets one thing.  What Microsoft product/add on is there to effectively manage a highly available, load managed farm of 200+ servers?  How about effectively managing 10 servers?  Sorry folks, they have a long way to go.
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I really with 'Guest' would reply and explain why he thinks Longhorn will do away with Citrix.  Guest offers nothing in way of reasoning at all.
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Mike,
This is a nice write-up--thanks for sharing your expertise.
 
I wanted to respond to your last paragraph:
 
Quote: Citrix Streaming Server (aka Tarpon), Softricity is now the first product that directly competes with Citrix. Presentation Server was always an "add on" to Terminal Server. However, customers will now have a decision to make between software virtualization platforms. It will be either Citrix OR Microsoft, but not both. I am curious to see how this will affect (if at all) the relationship between Microsoft and Citrix.]
 
Speaking as a Citrix employee, I think it's fair to say that customers and partners will look at Tarpon and Softricity as alternatives.  This is a far different thing than saying that Microsoft and Citrix are competitors.  Citrix and Microsoft are strong partners and we share similar (if not identical) goals.  Windows is Citrix's strategic platform, and our application delivery platform is aimed that lowering the cost of managing Windows, by providing the best app delivery solution for each app type used on a Windows-based PC.    The "war on costs" is of course a key Microsoft initiative as well.  Microsoft is doing things (like acquiring Softricity) to achieve this goal themselves, yet they also firmly believe that partners like Citrix are a big help in reaching this goal as well.
 
This alignment of goals (and great results from doing so) is why, at a strategic level, Microsoft has recognized Citrix as a great partner--we've won "Global ISV of the Year" twice in the past four years.  Microsoft doesn't let some product functionality overlap change the fundamental and strategic nature of the partnership, and neither does Citrix.  It's like the US and Canada--sure there are small differences in perspective, but fundamentally the relationship is strong because both parties have so much in common.
 
Furthermore--over time, I think we'll actually see Tarpon and Softricity sometimes coexist in the same customer environment.  In other words, I don't believe it will be "either/or" in many cases.  Think of it this way:  SMS is a good tool for managing desktops, but a number of IT shops often ask themselves "should I go SMS or use Citrix/Terminal Services?"   This doesn't mean SMS and TS/Pres Server are competitors, instead they are just different tools that are available to do a given job.  Over time I think that people will find relative strengths/weaknesses in the Softgrid and Tarpon technical implementations, which are significantly different.  In turn, people will choose the "right tool for the job" based on the requirements of that job.
 
And in the end Microsoft and Citrix will continue to share the same strategic goals and continue to be great partners, notwithstanding the similiarities between Softgrid and Tarpon.
 
Thanks again for the great article!
 
Bill Carovano (a Citrix employee)
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Why does everyone think Citrix is dead?
 
Citrix will not be dead but they will be seriously wounded.
 
Citrix is a half A** company.
 
1) Tarpon does not have a chance with Softricity. Citrix better throw it in for free. Tarpon is still vaporware. It still has not been released. If Tarpon is based on their Application Isolation - It is already a waste of time.
 
2) Citrix gets 33% of their revenues from Subscription Advantage? Is this true? Citrix is raping her own customers because people got nothing this last year while paying for the Subscription Advantage vaporware.
 
3) Citrix better start communicating to her partners and customers. MS lets us know what is in Longhorn. What will be in PS 5?  If Citrix calls this PS 4.5 they are stupid and this only proves their half a** mentality. Their name changes over the years really stink. They should have stuck with "Winframe" because this is exactly what Citrix is. You are running Windows based Software using a mainframe model.
 
4) Citrix markets AIE, CPU Management, Memory Management as if it is great stuff. It is all Half A** Marketing hype in PS 4. These features are a waste of time in their present state.
 
5) Citrix Education is a joke. The manuals come out late and have a mass amount of errors. Just read the questions and answers at the end of the chapters and you will know what I mean. 1256 course teaches old stuff like client update database. Citrix Education tells you you have to install the full PN to get pass through authentication to work with web interface.
 
6) Citrix Education makes you learn their Password Manager and AAC for the CCEA? That is a nice way to kill your CCEA certification demand. Are the masses using these products? I would guess 5% of citrix customers are using anything other than Presentation Server.
 
7) Learn and get certified on Citrix PS 4.0 - CCA, Learn VMware ESX - VCP, Learn Longhorn - MCSE, and Learn Softricity and your career will be on solid ground.
 
8) Citrix treats her customers and partners like SH**.
Citrix thinks they are King and it is their way or the highway.
They do not listen to anyone. They better change their tune!!!
 
I do not wish Citrix to go away but they better wake up and treat her customers and partners like they mean something.
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Bill,
 
Thanks for the compliments.  I'm sure that everyone would agree that Microsoft and Citrix have a great relationship, and I don't think anyone questions that.  However, my point was to simply bring to light the fact that Microsoft has a product that directly competes with Streaming Server, when compared to the other products the two companies offer, and who knows what affect this could have down the road.  Citrix Presentation Server is (and always has been) an add-on to Terminal Server, not a competing product, and Microsoft sells licenses every time a new Citrix PS server lights up on the network.
 
Although it is conceivable that some environments may implement both Softricity SoftGrid and Citrix Streaming Server, most environments will settle on one over the other.  I have yet to personally check out Streaming Server (although it is near the top of my list), but I can say that application streaming technology is seriously changing the way companies think about software deployment, and I'm sure Streaming Server will share in that.  However, there will be cases when Citrix finds themselves in a head-to-head competition for a company's Software Streaming business, and that competition may or may not have adverse effects on the relationships the two companies share.  No one can say (for sure) how acquisitions like this can have a ripple-effect 2 years (or 5 years) down the road.
 
As Citrix continues to grow, I'm sure this discussion will come up again as they expand their product offerings, and inevitably, products and/or features from Citrix and Microsoft begin to cross over one another.  As Brian, Doug and others have always done, it is the responsibility of the community to question these things and attempt to foresee the direction the industry will take, however unpredictable it may be.
 
- Mike
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1) Tarpon does not have a chance with Softricity. Citrix better throw it in for free. Tarpon is still vaporware. It still has not been released. If Tarpon is based on their Application Isolation - It is already a waste of time.
First off, you're wrong.  Citrix Streaming Server (a.k.a. Tarpon) will make its debut at iForum 2006.  Hardly vaporware.  As for competing with SoftGrid, it WILL compete and it will offer advantages over Softricity.  Softricity is a great product, but it can isolate things so well it becomes a detriment.  The fact that Streaming Server will not completely isolate things with a virtualization layer could be a good thing in some cases.  The fact that you make a blanket statement like this proves you do not understand the technology entirely.
 
2) Citrix gets 33% of their revenues from Subscription Advantage? Is this true? Citrix is raping her own customers because people got nothing this last year while paying for the Subscription Advantage vaporware.
Who cares if they get 33% revenues from SA?  How is that raping customers?  Typically, customers pay 12.5% of licenisng for SA ($400 Enterprise CAL = $50 SA renewal).  Many companies charge 20% or more for maintenance.
 
3) Citrix better start communicating to her partners and customers. MS lets us know what is in Longhorn. What will be in PS 5?  If Citrix calls this PS 4.5 they are stupid and this only proves their half a** mentality. Their name changes over the years really stink. They should have stuck with "Winframe" because this is exactly what Citrix is. You are running Windows based Software using a mainframe model.
Yeah, Microsoft lets us know what's in Longhorn, and then strips 50% of the features out before it hits GA.  If you know everything that's wrong with Citrix and how to fix it, then get a job there, climb to the top of the corporate ladder and get the job done. However, you may want to re-think your use of language an inflection... not too well liked in the corporate world.

4) Citrix markets AIE, CPU Management, Memory Management as if it is great stuff. It is all Half A** Marketing hype in PS 4. These features are a waste of time in their present state.
Everyone thought that Citrix should have these things in the product when they weren't.  Then they added them and now people are mad because they are incomplete.  They offer the basics.  If you need more than that, then get the full product from a 3rd party.  That's what partnerships are about, and being a good consultant means knowing the limitations and getting the customer the right solution - not complaining that one product doesn't fit the needs entirely.  Citrix licenses technology from a partner to fill feature gaps that its customers want.  The feature covers X, but if you need Y and Z as well, they advise you to get the full product from their partner, and they never hide that.
 
5) Citrix Education is a joke. The manuals come out late and have a mass amount of errors. Just read the questions and answers at the end of the chapters and you will know what I mean. 1256 course teaches old stuff like client update database. Citrix Education tells you you have to install the full PN to get pass through authentication to work with web interface.
Keep in mind that these courses and manuals need to train everyone - including those who just started in IT after building cars for 15 years.  If you are complaining about the documenation, then you haven't ever looked at the Advanced Concepts Guides.
 
6) Citrix Education makes you learn their Password Manager and AAC for the CCEA? That is a nice way to kill your CCEA certification demand. Are the masses using these products? I would guess 5% of citrix customers are using anything other than Presentation Server.
Citrix is more than a Presenation Server company.  Years ago in the olden days, they weren't, and many veterans are bitter about that now.  Companies that offer one product either get purchase (like Softricity), or expand their product line to stabilize their foothold in the industry (like Citrix).  Look at some of the other offerings.  The CAG and AAC are great products.  You can still get certified as a CCA on Presenation Server.  For the CCEA, you need to know more.  Ever look at what's required for an MCSE?  How many products does Microsoft ask you to learn?  Can you get an MCSE just knowing plain old Windows?  No.

It sounds like you have been burned in a Citrix relationship.  Unfortunately, when you make statement like "Citrix treats its customers and partners like sh**", no one will take you seriously.  Especially when you hide behind an anonymous login.
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ORIGINAL: As Brian, Doug and others have always done, it is the responsibility of the community to question these things and attempt to foresee the direction the industry will take, however unpredictable it may be.

 
I couldn't agree more.  One of the most fun things about working for Citrix is discussing and debating technology with smart people like you, Doug, Brian, and numerous others.  Citrix is fortunate to have such a great community around our products.
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May I assume then that you are not using Citrix products?  By your comments I can only assume that you are not.  If you are, why?  What value are you getting?  Why are you paying for the software if you get nothing from it?
 
I love you comment on Tarpon and Sotricity, just because they do things differently doesn't make one better than the other.  The fact that you are dismissing the product before you even see it tells me alot.  Even if Citrix releases a good product you simply won't accept it.  Why does Tarpon have to behave exactly like Softricity's products?  Did I miss a law going into effect that says software streamin gmust be done the exact same way no matter who releases it?  Why is the only way to do software streaming is through complete isolation?  Heh, if that were true then softricity products wouldn't work either.  oh you actually want to click on a .doc and have it open in word which is delivered through softricity?  I'm sorry but word is completely isolated from the OS and you can't do that.  Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.  think again.
 
Stop living in a world of black and white and you'll see that sometimes, just sometimes, shades of grey are a great thing.
 
Heh, I could go on but it obvious you are so jaded that it won't make much of a difference.  I love how you compare Microsoft who is the master of releasing half baked products to Citrix.  MS has made a living out of releasing products that are 'good enough'. 
 
As for subscription advantage, that is so funny it's silly.  Come on when was the last time MS made a deadline on their upgrade promises?  5 years and growing from XP to Vista, 5 or 6 years for SQL Server, and how much longer on Longhorn (and please don't say R2). 
 
heh, keep up the good work, I haven't gotten such a good laugh in a while.
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Being on the consulting side of things and not needing to pay for these SA contracts from MS and Citrix, etc.  I'll politely not dispute this person's issues with regard to SA.  I can certainly feel the pain of those customers who have sunk lots of money into things like Licensing 6.0 only to not receive any major product upgrades on the Windows/Office side of things.  I'd say unless you're personally the one who signs the check for XX million every year, I'd leave this guy to his gripes (as some of them are definitely legit).

Shawn

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From what anonymous says, I have apparently "missed the point" several times - therefore, I will just sit back an have another glass of Cool Aid. 

*glub*glub*
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You are correct.  Citrix is a half a** company these days ever since Ed I left there has been absolutely no innovative products.  Netscaler, yippee, it's a company they just bought and it's not making up for the 90% of the revenue that CPS does, so if CPS fails it then Citrix is screwed. 
 
Citrix is no longer an engineering company, most of engineering is quitting.  Management isn't listening and mostly Citrix is a marketing company.  So think about that, you say you support Citrix you're really just saying you support a bunch of marketing people because there is no one left in engineering.  They are just sitting around and milking what's left of CPS.
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mmm i work in engineering..I must be the only one left and I never realised doh!
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You do realize that most software companies are like that correct?  MS, only 2 money makers, Sun, Oracle, etc all the same.  Heh, I'm laughing even harder now
 
ORIGINAL: Guest

You are correct.  Citrix is a half a** company these days ever since Ed I left there has been absolutely no innovative products.  Netscaler, yippee, it's a company they just bought and it's not making up for the 90% of the revenue that CPS does, so if CPS fails it then Citrix is screwed. 

Citrix is no longer an engineering company, most of engineering is quitting.  Management isn't listening and mostly Citrix is a marketing company.  So think about that, you say you support Citrix you're really just saying you support a bunch of marketing people because there is no one left in engineering.  They are just sitting around and milking what's left of CPS.

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I love you guys. Citrix is your religion.....unfortunatly.
 
First of all - Your oppinions are more than welcome. We all have room for compromise and growth in our perspectives. All I ask is that you do not repond as a mouth-foaming madman cynic. Lets keep this above board - yes I know that is relative.
 
You are defending Tarpon to Softricity?
Softricity is a proven product.
Tarpon is not. If Tarpon is based on AIE than we are all in trouble.
 
You are comparing Citrix to MS? We all know that MS also has an integrity problem in regards to marketing compared to product release reality. They are the masters at that as you have pointed out.
 
I do not want to compare Citrix with MS with the exception of MS communicating to us what may be in Longhorn. Citrix is not communicating what will be in PS 4.5.  Meanwhile Citrix wants us to pay for another year of Subscription Advantage after getting no updates from it this past year. Nothing! Do you not understand that customers may have an issue with this????
 
I desire to hold Citrix accountable to integrity and truth. These are the standards to compare - not MS. You do not compare your wife's fidelity with MS - do you?
 
I am not the only one who has a beef with Citrix. We probably would not be reading this thread if Citrix responded to their customer, employees, and partner base with respect. Citrix needs to value and hold her partners in high esteem instead of looking at them as "how could we get more money out of them?." 
Citrix customers and partners are her biggest supporters.
 
It is good for the customer that MS bought Softricity instead of Citrix. Citrix would probably have raised the cost for Softricity. MS sees the value in volume to the masses. This is a big win for the customer.
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Whoa, Jeff, now he's bringing your wife into this...  

First off, Citrix is not "our religion", it's part (and only part) of how we make a living.

You are totally dismissing a product (Tarpon) before you have even seen it or have an understanding of its capabilities.  That means you are short sighted and pessimistic.  I don't care what a vendor's past track record is, you still need to look at every product with the same objectivity.  Tarpon may suck, or it may end up being great.  No one knows right now, so it is a rediculous to speculate how the product will be.  If you really know Softricity so well, then you would also know that it has shortcomings also, of which some customers would call "an incomplete, half-a**ed" product.  If you have worked with it for a long time, then you would know that a little over a year ago, it was a much worse product, with "features" that didn't even work.  The first version of Tarpon will have its issues.  What makes a great consultant/engineer is to know those limitations, be able to work around them, and know when it is and isn't a good fit for a business need.

Secondly, you continually state how Citrix rips its customers off with SA by not releasing anything for a year.  As Jeff has said, Microsoft does this as well, more often, and on top of that they charge 50% of the licensing cost for their SA program (and yes, it gets you 2 years, but it's still more expensive).

The points you make are unfounded and short-sighted.  You see the only the side of the arguement you wish to see and dismiss everything else.  It's great to be as passionate about something as you (and the community) are, but only if that passion drives you to become a better professional, not a heckler from the back row.
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First off, again, you have no idea how good Tarpon is or is not going to be.  So what if it's based on AIE, Windows Longhorn is based on Windows 2003, which is based on Windows 2000, which is based on Windows NT, which is based on Windows NT 3.51, which is based on Windows NT 3.1.  Huh, not exactly the best pedigree.  Do you think Softricities 1.0 products was any good?  Heh, that product was a product that worked 'in theory' but in practice sucked.  I would actually give Tarpon a much better chance of succes at this point.  But you are right in one thing, Tarpon needs to work out of the box.  If it's going to require a ton of hotfixes to get it working, then it will fail.
 
Second, again your holding Citrix to a different standard.  that's the part that frustrates me about this thread.  MS hasn't delivered any product within their SA but yet where is your complaining on that?  I'm willing to bet you spend a lot more money on MS SA then Citrix.  As well, you pay a whole lot more product ofr product on MS's SA than Citrix's.  Where are the complaints?  I do understand that customers have a problem with not getting upgrades but let's be realistic for one moment, most companies don't upgrade every single cycle.  WHAT YOU SAY!!!  THEY DON'T??!!  How many people still use old version of office or have Windows 2000 sitting around or even NT4?  Quite a few.  How many people still use Metaframe XP?  A lot.  So.......
 
Third, Integrity and truth.  Yes it would be nice but again this is what I'd like out of every company I deal with and it's few and far between.  To pick on Citrix alone is simply childish.
 
Fourth, I've got a many many beefs with Citrix and I've written about it many times.  I also believe in proper blame placement and discussions that are done in a reasonable manner.  This is definately not one fo those cases.  Whenever people start speaking in generalities like this thread has done, then they are looking to just complain and they aren't willing to listen to reason.  Mike Burke posted a wonderful post earlier that was thoughful and thought out and he got slammed for it.  Simply because he or I may defend Citrix or rebute what someone thinks doesn't make any of us schills for Citrix. 
 
Again, if you feel you aren't getting value from Citrix products THEN DON'T BUY THEM.  I will be more than happy to introduce you to competing products from Provision Networks, Ericom, etc.  Much to your dismay, you will find that I do much more than just Citrix products.
 
 
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I think Jeff and Mike have blown a gasket.... :)
 
Hey guys lighten up....this isn't religion and it isn't your family.......or is it?
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We've blown a gasket?  Oh please stop, if you mean because I'm laughing so hard then your right.  I love watching irrational people post about things they obviously do not understand.
 
I'm sorry but when everyone wants to have rational, intelligent discussions about these types of things then we shall actually get somewhere. 
 
oh, the laughing almost hurts......
 
ORIGINAL: Guest

I think Jeff and Mike have blown a gasket.... :)

Hey guys lighten up....this isn't religion and it isn't your family.......or is it?

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By the way, why ar eyou so afraid to post your name?  If your going to try insulting people, at least have the guts to post your names. 
 
And no one has still answered the question of why do they buy Citrix's products if they see no value in them.
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Now Now Jeffy......put the pacifier back in your mouth....it will be ok....people are simply sharing their perspectives and I am sure you can learn to respect that. Right Jeffy?
 
Where did anyone ever say that PS or all of the Citrix products did not have any value? I really liked "Vertigo" ....didn't you?  Be careful about jumping to conclusions....ok Jeffy...
 
Take a few deep breaths Jeffy......it will be ok when mommy gets home....  
 
The language used is meant to motivate, shame and get the attention of Citrix.

Jeffy.....are you still laughing?........cause a lot of us are.........
 
For more entertainment go over to the article that Ron Oglesby wrote on Citrix attempt to enter the VDI space.....Ron says it is a stop gap measure....sounds like we are back to half A** again.....There are a lot of entertaining comments by many non-anonomous people.......What do you think Jeffy?     https://www.brianmadden.com/content/content.asp?id=618
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lol, now you actually resort to name calling and direct insults?  It just keeps getting better and better.  And you still refuse to show yourself.  Now you have shown your true colors and actually made our arguements that much more meaningful.  Thank you, it is greatly appreciated. 
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I like cheese...

Shawn
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It's fine to stay anonymous but it shouldn'be used to be offensive. Shame on you!

Other than that, I agree that paying for updates that are not being delivered it's a nonsense. Be Citrix, Microsoft or anyone else.
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I was very close to the situation, and Citrix did attempt to aquire Softricity twice this year, in February and March.  So say what you want about Tarpon.  But if I read into this, it tells me Tarpon has major problems.  You try to buy a comapny 7-10 months before your release date.  And please don't tell me, I don't know about the proposed buy, I know...
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Microsoft doesn't let some product functionality overlap change the fundamental and strategic nature of the partnership, and neither does Citrix.

Bill, you could not be more off base with that statement. Are you drinking the Citrix Koolaid there?

Citrix has a BAD habit of letting product functinality from partners affect the fundamental and strategic level of partnerships.  Ask Citrix Alliance Partner Softricity, oh yeah!  They kicked Softricity out of their program a year ago when they thought they had an overlapping technology.  Well ask Expand, oh yeah, they kicked them out of the partner program too!  Well, ask Premitech, oh shoot, I think they got kicked out as well when refectant was purchased.  I was and Exec. of Marketing for a Citrix Business Alliance partner and last year we also got a threatening in-person meeting where they point blank told us that they would kick us out if they decided that there was significant functionality overlap.  I know this stuff first hand.

Citrix is a bulley.  They'll ultimatlely get what is coming to them.  At least Microsoft keeps Citrix as a partner, even though they try to compete every day.
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For the record, yes I do drink the Citrix kool-aid :-)   I am a Citrix employee and every two weeks I get a paycheck with Citrix's name on it!  This paycheck helps to clothe and feed my family, so yes I love the Citrix kool-aid!!
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Citrix partner and ISV ecosystem, it is a shame, that they won't try to let more partners provide value to PS without squeezing them out..
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I AGREE!  CITRIX IS An Arrogant BULLY and paranoid. This is an accurate way to explain how Citrix treats her partners.  Burning bridges will eventually burn Citrix!
 
ie..Citrix takes away the Subscription Advantage sales. Citrix takes away the customer.
 
ie..Citrix tells her partners that they own all the clients and the partners do not. THIS IS SO ARROGANT!  What if MS told Citrix that they own the clients?.....In reality the reseller does own the clients and can now sell them Softricity and VMWare instead of Citrix. 
 
This is the kind of culture MARK TEMPLETON has nurtured.
SH** flows down hill and now it is starting to flow back!
 
ORIGINAL: Guest

Microsoft doesn't let some product functionality overlap change the fundamental and strategic nature of the partnership, and neither does Citrix.

Bill, you could not be more off base with that statement. Are you drinking the Citrix Koolaid there?

Citrix has a BAD habit of letting product functinality from partners affect the fundamental and strategic level of partnerships.  Ask Citrix Alliance Partner Softricity, oh yeah!  They kicked Softricity out of their program a year ago when they thought they had an overlapping technology.  Well ask Expand, oh yeah, they kicked them out of the partner program too!  Well, ask Premitech, oh shoot, I think they got kicked out as well when refectant was purchased.  I was and Exec. of Marketing for a Citrix Business Alliance partner and last year we also got a threatening in-person meeting where they point blank told us that they would kick us out if they decided that there was significant functionality overlap.  I know this stuff first hand.

Citrix is a bulley.  They'll ultimatlely get what is coming to them.  At least Microsoft keeps Citrix as a partner, even though they try to compete every day.
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I guess it is ok to rip off the customer because MS does it ......great logic.....sheesh.....you and Jeff will defend Citrix to the nth degree.....remember.....MS is not the integrity standard.......truth and honesty are absolutes.....and are never justified by greed.....or because MS does it.
 
Respect someone elses oppinion and leave it at that....or give your oppinion but try to make sense before you give it.
Leave your emotion out of it and you will think more clearly and make more sense.  
 
I remember debate wars between Apple people and IBM. I remember debate wars between Novell and MS....the debates will continue but the market ultimately decides....
 
I hope Citrix starts treating people with respect and building bridges instead of burning them before it is too late. They are the most arrogant of companies....and to think they could have owned Softricity and VMWare and the whole virtualization market.....It is a bad thing to let pride, greed and arrogance get in the way as Citrix does.
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Yes, but most company actually continue to develop thier products.
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Would that be the same respect that has been shown Mike and I?  Simply because we gave a differing opinion we are ridiculed and put down.  Even your post which asks for respect of opinions still puts us down for offering ours.  How does that make any sense?
 
No one said MS is the integrity standard, the point being made is is that almost every software company (especially large ones) follow these practices.  it is not uncommon and Citrix is not the only one doing it.  I'm not defending what they do, I'm simply saying that they are by no means the only player that does this.  And no, for the record, it is not right. 
 
All this simply because we may disagree.  Please take your own advice and respect our opinion.  Oh, and go read some some of things I've written about Citrix in the past.  It has hardly been flattering.  So before you throw some blanket judgement about the rest of us, do the research first. 
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Your quote"
"And no, for the record, it is not right."
 
Thanks.
Now we have common ground. 
I think we are coming to consensus in some areas. I do not expect full agreement on all things.
 
We all know that Citrix has done a lot of good things with Presentation Server.
We all know that they can do better in many areas.
I have been promoting Citrix for over 6+ years. I know Citrix fairly well and know they allienate people. Just read some of what Brian Madden and others have written.
 
I just know the Citrix attitude and Mark Templeton has to change in some areas. Here are my suggestions and know their is always room for compromise.
 
1) Be more up front in communication to everyone.
2) Quit being the Bully to customers and partners.
3) Do not come out with Half butt products and market them as if they are golden. I don't care what MS does. Do what is right, noble, and with integrity. ie...AIE, CPU optimization, Memory optimization, IM, etc...
4) Do not charge customers for air. They got nothing for the Subscription Advanage they paid for. I do not think you are ever going to convince people that this is a noble thing to do. Solution - For every month beyond a year that customers did not receieve an update - simply extend their SA a month. What is wrong with that?
5) Don't tell partners that you own the customer as Citrix does. This is pure arrogance.
6) Citrix: Be honest - If it were not for Brian Madden and this site- we would be in the dark with many issues. Citrix is not up front with their product issues and plans as they should be.
7) Citrix: Quit being so paranoid. Build bridges and do not burn them. Be open to customers and partners.
8) Communicate to customers what are the new features to expect in the new products. Do not over market a new feature. Be truthful. and yes - we know many companies do this.
9) Accept customers and partners input....Seek it with passion. Partners are your friend. It is free consulting at the very least.
10) Don't have an attitude of "its my way or the high way."
 
It is mostly attitude that I have an issue with. I think you may see some common ground in the above.
 
To go full circle. I am sorry if I offended you and Mike at some points. Yes - my attitude was not noble or above board. I ask for your forgiveness in any offense. 
 
anonymous - you may prefer that I offer my name but it is my preference for several reasons and Brian Madden has given us this option.
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Am I the only one that thinks this makes it difficult to justify the cost of licensing and management that is associated with implementing and supporting VDI? The main benefit of VDI is that each user has their own environment where applications and settings will not conflict with anyone else. Why pay for VMWare ESX, Windows XP Professional, Access Software (Citrix VDI or other), AntiVirus, Backup, and SMS? I would rather have a terminal server farm, back up each server, provide antivirus for each server, manage each server, and use SoftGrid to let users run whatever applications they need whenever and wherever they need to. Even if I only get half of the users on my terminal server due to the SoftGrid virtualization it would be better than the alternative. It seems to me that terminal server with SoftGrid represents a good compromise for 98% of companies out there.
 
 
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That is where Microsoft's vast partner network will come through. Their is already Provision Networks that lets you assign SoftGrid applications in a terminal server environment. With the lower license costs there is room for partners to develop and offer add-ons that fill in the gaps. I could not pay for a terminal server license, $400 for Citrix, pay $200 for SoftGrid, and then pay extra for a third party product that fills in the gaps. But, I could pay for the terminal server license, $20 for SoftGrid, and maybe $99 dollars for something that fills in all of the gaps and makes my life easier. So instead of paying almost $700 per user I will only be paying $200 per user.
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I used to work at Citrix.  You should see how they're even pushing the employees out of the company!
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I worked there as well, If I could post some of the questionable things they did to employees, on this board, people might have a different perspective of ole' Citrix
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I believe that Softricity will win out, it's been around a lot longer, it's more proven than a new release and it's isolating the Operating System which Microsoft also owns.  It would be much easier for Softritity now to respond to changes and fix things than Citrix would be able to.  Also don't forget x64 where patchcard comes into play, Citrix would have a more difficult time where as softricity being part of the OS would not.  I think Citrix is making a big mistake attempting to take on Microsoft with a zero generation product.
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During all of this discussion Microsoft and Citrix inked another deal. Doesn't seem that their relationship is scarred to deep (yet).
 
Microsoft and Citrix to collaborate on developing and marketing a new Citrix WANScalerâ„¢ branch office appliance based on Microsoft Windows Server and Microsoft ISA Server.(August 23, 2006)
 
 
 
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Jeff's quote:
"oh you actually want to click on a .doc and have it open in word which is delivered through softricity? 
I'm sorry but word is completely isolated from the OS and you can't do that.  Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.  think again."
 
Jeff:
Where did you hear this? Did Citrix tell you this?
 
YOU CAN associate file type extensions with the Softricity streamed applications.
 
The fact remains that Softicity is a mature and proven product.
Tarpon is a rev. 1.0 product and not even available.
Why are you defending a product that hasn't even been released?
 
Time will tell and we will leave it at that for now.

 
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wow, talk about talking a quote out of context.  READ THE MESSAGE!!!  My point was that if Softricity was as isolated as people were saying YOU COULDN"T DO THAT.  I'm saying that softricity isn't as isolated as they were making it out to be and that you could associate file types. 
 
Please, read the entire message and don't quote out of context. 
 
why am I defending a product that hasn't been released?  Probably the same reason people are attacking it.  I believe in giving the product a chance before ripping it apart.  Everyone deserves a chance, even Citrix.  After the product is released and I have tested it, then I will make my opinion known.
 
How hard is any of this to understand?
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Mr. Anonymous:
Could you give us a few examples?
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OK - It is official. Tarpon is not vaporware!
 
You can now download Tarpon version 1.0
 
To download the product go to:
ftp://uploads.citrix.com/Tarpon/
Username: usr_Tarpon
Password: Citrix
 
To obtain a license, please contact Donnie Page at
donnie.page@citrix.com.

Let the testers and implementors offer their feedback.
 
Does anyone know the cost of Tarpon licenses?
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Like promote people who don't do any work and *** on people who do?
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Truthfully, that sounds like most companies. 
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Great point!!! This is exactly what I found out in talking to the giant governmental customer below.

 
Citrix is already losing part of her current customer base.

 
I just talked to a large US military division.

They are a giant Citrix customer.

They said that Citrix sales people were so arrogant and expensive that the military decision makers asked, "How can we avoid using Citrix?"

Instead of paying the 7-8 million upgrade bill -  
This government division bought enough Citrix upgrades for only the departments that absolutly needed the upgrades.

They have started a planned implementation of a 2 year phase out of Citrix.

They will be going with MS/Softricity Softgrid organization wide.
 
When Longhorn comes out - they will test Longhorn.

If Longhorn does most of what they need - Citrix is history at this US division.

 
Citrix does have central enterprise management with the datastore and management tools - beyond this I think Longhorn is closing the gap.

 
Citrix needs to get rid of her arrogance fast!!!

Citrix is a thug and needs to humble herself  - attitude is everything.


Because Mark Templeton sets the culture - He is the example of arrogance and inflexibility.
The employees will reflect the attitude of the leaders.
 
I am happy that this government military division has decided to save some of our hard earned tax payer money.

They do not need subcription advantage because they update every 3-4 years and they just updated to CPS 4.0.

There has not been a new version of Citrix PS 4.0 in almost 17 months and counting.....

.....now why should we be buying subscription advantage, Mark?
 
A word to the wise.....Are you listening Citrix? The writing is on the wall......
 
By the way.....why isn't Citrix using Password Manager internally company wide?....this is another story for another day....
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LOL. Some peoples kids... best to just ignore them.

I just got a 6 user license of Tarpon for attending the seminar "Making IT efficinet:Architecting for results"

So far it looks pretty nifty. There is a wizard to publish the streaming app. It records the install so it knows what files are created and registry keys, etc. Anyone that has used zenworks will recognize the technique they are using. I can definately see a use for this.

It's nothing at all like the isolation environements despite what our friendly flamer says. It streams the files down to the client so they can be run offline. If the user deletes the files, it just puts them back. They were saying that this feature will be available for your PS servers the next version after 4.5. Think about that... You won't even have to install apps on your Citrix servers. The apps themselves would be streamed to the Citrix servers then published from there :)
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oopsie. the above post was me.
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